The Pyramid Rating System: The Results

No surprise: Barry Bonds ranks near the top of the Pyramid Ratings System. (via Kevin Rushforth)
It’s been awhile since my first article back in August, and in that time I’ve been hard at work refining my ranking system. I’ve adjusted the way offensive production is evaluated, readjusted my position requirements and have also included the 2015 season into my overall rankings. I’ve also been working on a few other surprises, which I hope to delve into in future articles, but for now, on to the results.
As mentioned in the first article, players were evaluated on a season-by-season basis, with each season being rated on a 20-80 scale that reflects the commonly accepted scale used by MLB scouts. One question I don’t feel gets asked often enough by rating systems developers is how much correlation exists between the player rating and overall team success.
Below is a scatter graph of each major league season — starting in 1901 — and the odds that a player’s team won the pennant. Partial and combined seasons were removed, as well as the entire 1994 season.

As you can see, there does appear to be a pretty strong — almost linear — correlation between a player’s overall rating and the odds his team will reach the World Series, right up until the highest rating of 80. If a player has a rating of 80, the chance his team will reach the World Series is 25 percent, which is seven percent higher than any other rating. What I believe this suggests is major league baseball might be a bit more like the NBA than people think, where one player can have a significant impact on a team’s odds of winning, provided that player is one of the one or two best players in the game.
As it relates to evaluating players all time, the fundamental question we have to ask is: What are we looking for? The answer to this question in my opinion is: Who are the players who most help you win the World Series? The above graph would suggest an increased value attached to peak dominance over career longevity, which the Pyramid Rating System captures.
This approach is very different from asking who is the most talented. The most talented player to me would suggest the skill set that goes into making a great major leaguer is always static. One look at the major league record books will tell you the records set tend to be as much a product of the era as they are of the player.
The PRS defines who is the most valuable, which is decided as much by the era as it is by the player’s ability. A catcher with a great arm in the 1950s will not have as much value as one in the 1980s simply because there were more bases being stolen in the ’80s than there were in the ’50s.
This is reflected in other ways as well.

Looking at the MLB league leader in range factor for shortstops, we can see a very clear downward trend over time. Andrelton Simmons gets about two fewer chances per game than Dave Bancroft did. As you would expect, pre-WWII-era shortstops rate much higher defensively than their modern counterparts do. In fact, of the top ten greatest defensive seasons in history according to the Pyramid Rating System, nine of them are middle infielders from before WWII. Only Mark Belanger’s 1975 season cracked the top ten.
This graph gets right to the heart of talent versus value. Was Bancroft a better defensive player than Simmons? It’s tough to say. Both were/are arguably the best in their respective eras, so the question of who was more dominant relative to his counterparts also must be asked. In terms of who was more valuable, to me there is no doubt Bancroft’s defensive ability had far more of an effect on the Giants success than Simmons’ defensive ability had on the Braves, and it is simply because Bancroft had more balls hit to him than Simmons did. This is the lens by which players should be looked at all time. When you try to adjust for era and neutralize stats, I feel you turn players into something they never were.
I’ve created my own Hall of Fame based on these PRS results. The rules were very simple. A five-year waiting period requirement still was in place, and three players were inducted in even years, two in odd years. I also passed no judgment on players like Pete Rose or Joe Jackson. Whether the two should be inducted is up for endless debate. I have simply included the two as an illustration of the talent needed to get into the Hall of Fame. The only thing I will say on the subject is that the inclusion of Cap Anson — who bet on numerous games throughout his career, as well as being instrumental in the establishment of the “gentleman’s agreement” to keep black players out of the game — shows the only thing the Hall of Fame respects more than the integrity of the game is the grandfather clause.
Below is a graph showing the percentage of active players in the league who would later go on to be inducted in the Hall of Fame.

Unlike the real Hall of Fame, in my hall of fame the percentage of players who would go on to be inducted rarely drops below four percent and rarely rises above six percent, which demonstrates a lack of basis toward or against any era. Each era is proportionally represented, both in who is inducted in the Hall as well as the overall rankings themselves. Some of the more modern inductees may lead to some head scratching, but the idea of Curt Schilling being considered a borderline HOFer to me is a demonstration of just how stingy voters have become in recent years rather than an actual reflection of his talent.
In closing, what’s most important is to treat these rankings more as estimates than absolutes. The difference between the 190th-ranked player (Cole Hamels) and the 215th-ranked player (Jimmy Key) is almost non-existent. Assuming these two players played at the same time, a trade of one for the other wouldn’t have a significant impact on either team’s long-term win-loss record. If the rankings were absolute, it may not be possible for a bad team ever to beat a good one. This type of uncertainty always must be taken into account when looking at results like this. It’s the uncertainty that makes playing the games worthwhile.
The other thing to stress is how much respect and admiration I have for the players even in the 400s. Even at that level, we’re still talking about guys who were better than 98 percent of the players ever to play the game at the major league level. Just because I have Player X ranked ahead of them does not mean I can’t also appreciate the amount of skill and talent these players had. The further down this list you go, the more blurred the difference between players becomes, and those rankings are far more fascinating than what is at the top.

Name | Pos | Pri | Overall | Off | Def |
Babe Ruth | CO | RF | 1 | 1 | 787 |
Barry Bonds | LF | LF | 2 | 2 | 141 |
Willie Mays | CF | CF | 3 | 6 | 66 |
Roger Clemens | P | P | 4 | 5857 | |
Ty Cobb | OF | CF | 5 | 3 | 1257 |
Rogers Hornsby | MI | 2B | 6 | 4 | 57 |
Ted Williams | LF | LF | 7 | 5 | 1955 |
Walter Johnson | P | P | 8 | 1758 | |
Honus Wagner | SS | SS | 9 | 8 | 41 |
Randy Johnson | P | P | 10 | 7680 | |
Alex Rodriguez | SS/3B | SS | 11 | 11 | 115 |
Stan Musial | OF/1B | 1B | 12 | 9 | 864 |
Mike Schmidt | 3B | 3B | 13 | 19 | 72 |
Tris Speaker | CF | CF | 14 | 12 | 400 |
Lefty Grove | P | P | 15 | 6143 | |
Mickey Mantle | CF/1B | CF | 16 | 10 | 968 |
Albert Pujols | 1B/LF | 1B | 17 | 18 | 483 |
Lou Gehrig | 1B | 1B | 18 | 7 | 1808 |
Hank Aaron | RF | RF | 19 | 14 | 439 |
Eddie Collins | 2B | 2B | 20 | 15 | 140 |
Cy Young | P | P | 21 | 3362 | |
Greg Maddux | P | P | 22 | 4269 | |
Rickey Henderson | OF | LF | 23 | 28 | 222 |
Pedro Martinez | P | P | 24 | 8344 | |
Joe Morgan | 2B | 2B | 25 | 16 | 313 |
Wade Boggs | 3B | 3B | 26 | 32 | 178 |
Nap Lajoie | 2B/1B | 2B | 27 | 22 | 116 |
Jimmie Foxx | 1B | 1B | 28 | 17 | 1436 |
Cal Ripken | SS/3B | SS | 29 | 39 | 5 |
Dan Brouthers | 1B | 1B | 30 | 13 | 811 |
Roger Connor | 1B | 1B | 31 | 27 | 233 |
Pete Alexander | P | P | 32 | 3365 | |
Mel Ott | RF | RF | 33 | 21 | 902 |
Cap Anson | 1B | 1B | 34 | 23 | 269 |
Roy Halladay | P | P | 35 | 7992 | |
Ken Griffey | CF | CF | 36 | 36 | 182 |
George Brett | CI | 3B | 37 | 33 | 255 |
Robin Roberts | P | P | 38 | 2856 | |
Ross Barnes | MI | 2B | 39 | 75 | 196 |
Clayton Kershaw | P | P | 40 | 4199 | |
Eddie Mathews | 3B | 3B | 41 | 20 | 349 |
Curt Schilling | P | P | 42 | 6842 | |
Joe DiMaggio | CF | CF | 43 | 38 | 524 |
Tom Seaver | P | P | 44 | 3788 | |
Bert Blyleven | P | P | 45 | 6754 | |
Roberto Clemente | RF | RF | 46 | 72 | 164 |
Frank Robinson | CO/1B | RF | 47 | 26 | 1209 |
Ron Santo | 3B | 3B | 48 | 54 | 194 |
Ed Delahanty | OF/1B | LF | 49 | 24 | 1552 |
Mike Mussina | P | P | 50 | ||
Johnny Mize | 1B | 1B | 51 | 35 | 2515 |
Mariano Rivera | P | P | 52 | ||
Christy Mathewson | P | P | 53 | 3064 | |
Warren Spahn | P | P | 54 | 2338 | |
Phil Niekro | P | P | 55 | 5070 | |
Adrian Beltre | 3B | 3B | 56 | 91 | 29 |
Gaylord Perry | P | P | 57 | 5695 | |
Jack Glasscock | SS | SS | 58 | 112 | 22 |
Jeff Bagwell | 1B | 1B | 59 | 45 | 1714 |
Carl Yastrzemski | LF/1B | LF | 60 | 63 | 259 |
Arky Vaughan | SS/3B | SS | 61 | 40 | 130 |
Steve Carlton | P | P | 62 | 3286 | |
Bob Gibson | P | P | 63 | 2623 | |
Rod Carew | 1B/2B | 1B | 64 | 46 | 613 |
Bob Feller | P | P | 65 | 4642 | |
Jackie Robinson | IF | 2B | 66 | 65 | 86 |
Kevin Brown | P | P | 67 | 5784 | |
Johan Santana | P | P | 68 | 5709 | |
Chase Utley | 2B | 2B | 69 | 161 | 102 |
Ernie Banks | 1B/SS | 1B | 70 | 64 | 142 |
Mike Trout | OF | CF | 71 | 29 | 1049 |
Shoeless Joe Jackson | OF | LF | 72 | 34 | 2198 |
Gary Carter | C | C | 73 | 119 | 25 |
Robinson Cano | 2B | 2B | 74 | 81 | 248 |
Dave Stieb | P | P | 75 | ||
Ed Walsh | P | P | 76 | 4098 | |
Kid Nichols | P | P | 77 | 3798 | |
Ryne Sandberg | 2B | 2B | 78 | 51 | 163 |
Johnny Bench | C | C | 79 | 98 | 71 |
Jim Bunning | P | P | 80 | 4339 | |
Duke Snider | OF | CF | 81 | 47 | 728 |
Lou Boudreau | SS | SS | 82 | 107 | 16 |
Bobby Grich | 2B | 2B | 83 | 84 | 136 |
Frank Thomas | 1B | 1B | 84 | 31 | 4339 |
Charlie Gehringer | 2B | 2B | 85 | 55 | 99 |
Chipper Jones | 3B/LF | 3B | 86 | 44 | 725 |
George Davis | UT | SS | 87 | 89 | 26 |
Al Kaline | OF | RF | 88 | 101 | 234 |
Pete Rose | UT | 1B | 89 | 57 | 504 |
Brooks Robinson | 3B | 3B | 90 | 245 | 9 |
Robin Yount | SS/CF | SS | 91 | 43 | 125 |
David Cone | P | P | 92 | 4922 | |
Andruw Jones | CF | CF | 93 | 326 | 11 |
Alan Trammell | SS | SS | 94 | 103 | 50 |
Reggie Jackson | RF | RF | 95 | 52 | 1084 |
George Sisler | 1B | 1B | 96 | 71 | 1316 |
Wilbur Wood | P | P | 97 | 8056 | |
Sandy Koufax | P | P | 98 | 5869 | |
Home Run Baker | 3B | 3B | 99 | 49 | 221 |
Billy Hamilton | OF | CF | 100 | 53 | 2030 |

Year | Name | Year | Name | Year | Name | Year | Name |
1936 | Ty Cobb | 1956 | Joe Gordon | 1976 | Joe Kelley | 1997 | Dwight Evans |
1936 | Walter Johnson | 1956 | Bill Terry | 1977 | Ernie Banks | 1997 | Rick Reuschel |
1936 | Honus Wagner | 1957 | Jesse Burkett | 1977 | Jim Bunning | 1998 | Bert Blyleven |
1937 | Eddie Collins | 1957 | Joe DiMaggio | 1978 | Roberto Clemente | 1998 | Gary Carter |
1937 | Tris Speaker | 1958 | Lou Boudreau | 1978 | Zack Wheat | 1998 | Jose Cruz |
1938 | Dan Brouthers | 1958 | Sherry Magee | 1978 | Hoyt Wilhelm | 1999 | George Brett |
1938 | Nap Lajoie | 1958 | George Wright | 1979 | Yogi Berra | 1999 | Robin Yount |
1938 | Cy Young | 1959 | Johnny Mize | 1979 | Willie Mays | 2000 | Rich Gossage |
1939 | Pete Alexander | 1959 | Bobby Veach | 1980 | Dave Bancroft | 2000 | Dale Murphy |
1939 | Roger Connor | 1960 | Art Fletcher | 1980 | Al Kaline | 2000 | Nolan Ryan |
1940 | Cap Anson | 1960 | Paul Hines | 1980 | Ron Santo | 2001 | Kirby Puckett |
1940 | Ross Barnes | 1960 | Dutch Leonard | 1981 | Bob Gibson | 2001 | Lou Whitaker |
1940 | Ed Delahanty | 1961 | Ralph Kiner | 1981 | Juan Marichal | 2002 | Andre Dawson |
1941 | Christy Mathewson | 1961 | Hal Newhouser | 1982 | Hank Aaron | 2002 | Ozzie Smith |
1941 | Babe Ruth | 1962 | Bob Feller | 1982 | Frank Robinson | 2002 | Alan Trammell |
1942 | Jack Glasscock | 1962 | Bobo Newsom | 1982 | Billy Williams | 2003 | Ryne Sandberg |
1942 | Shoeless Joe Jackson | 1962 | Jackie Robinson | 1983 | Dick Allen | 2003 | Frank Viola |
1942 | Ed Walsh | 1963 | Eddie Plank | 1983 | Brooks Robinson | 2004 | Paul Molitor |
1943 | Rogers Hornsby | 1963 | Joe Sewell | 1984 | Vada Pinson | 2004 | Eddie Murray |
1943 | Kid Nichols | 1964 | Fred Clarke | 1984 | Wilbur Wood | 2004 | Dave Stieb |
1944 | Home Run Baker | 1964 | Ted Lyons | 1984 | Jim Wynn | 2005 | Wade Boggs |
1944 | George Davis | 1964 | Pee Wee Reese | 1985 | Willie Davis | 2005 | Mark Langston |
1944 | George Sisler | 1965 | Larry Doby | 1985 | Harmon Killebrew | 2006 | Dennis Eckersley |
1945 | Lou Gehrig | 1965 | Vic Willis | 1986 | Jim Fregosi | 2006 | Carlton Fisk |
1945 | Billy Hamilton | 1966 | Jimmy Collins | 1986 | Willie McCovey | 2006 | Jimmy Key |
1946 | Stan Coveleski | 1966 | John McGraw | 1986 | Minnie Minoso | 2007 | Cal Ripken |
1946 | Harry Heilmann | 1966 | Ted Williams | 1987 | Sal Bando | 2007 | Bret Saberhagen |
1946 | Dazzy Vance | 1967 | Willie Keeler | 1987 | Bobby Bonds | 2008 | Tony Gwynn |
1947 | Goose Goslin | 1967 | Joe Medwick | 1988 | Reggie Smith | 2008 | Mark McGwire |
1947 | Lefty Grove | 1968 | Richie Ashburn | 1988 | Luis Tiant | 2008 | Tim Raines |
1948 | Sam Crawford | 1968 | King Kelly | 1988 | Roy White | 2009 | David Cone |
1948 | Wes Ferrell | 1968 | Rube Waddell | 1989 | Gaylord Perry | 2009 | Rickey Henderson |
1948 | Charlie Gehringer | 1969 | Stan Musial | 1989 | Carl Yastrzemski | 2010 | Roberto Alomar |
1949 | Bill Dahlen | 1969 | Bucky Walters | 1990 | Johnny Bench | 2010 | Barry Larkin |
1949 | Bobby Wallace | 1970 | Charlie Keller | 1990 | Fergie Jenkins | 2010 | Edgar Martinez |
1950 | John Clarkson | 1970 | Billy Pierce | 1990 | Joe Morgan | 2011 | Jeff Bagwell |
1950 | Hughie Jennings | 1970 | Duke Snider | 1991 | Rod Carew | 2011 | Kevin Brown |
1950 | Al Simmons | 1971 | Cupid Childs | 1991 | Jim Palmer | 2012 | Kevin Appier |
1951 | Joe Cronin | 1971 | Warren Spahn | 1992 | Bobby Grich | 2012 | Rafael Palmeiro |
1951 | Jimmie Foxx | 1972 | Sandy Koufax | 1992 | Pete Rose | 2012 | Larry Walker |
1952 | Frankie Frisch | 1972 | Robin Roberts | 1992 | Tom Seaver | 2013 | Barry Bonds |
1952 | Carl Hubbell | 1972 | Urban Shocker | 1993 | Reggie Jackson | 2013 | Roger Clemens |
1952 | Paul Waner | 1973 | Pete Browning | 1993 | Phil Niekro | 2014 | Greg Maddux |
1953 | Hank Greenberg | 1973 | Nellie Fox | 1994 | Steve Carlton | 2014 | Mike Mussina |
1953 | Mel Ott | 1974 | Bob Johnson | 1994 | Cesar Cedeno | 2014 | Curt Schilling |
1954 | Elmer Flick | 1974 | Mickey Mantle | 1994 | Graig Nettles | 2015 | Randy Johnson |
1954 | Amos Rusie | 1974 | Eddie Mathews | 1995 | Buddy Bell | 2015 | Pedro Martinez |
1954 | Arky Vaughan | 1975 | Ken Boyer | 1995 | Mike Schmidt | 2016 | Ken Griffey |
1955 | Joe McGinnity | 1975 | Don Drysdale | 1996 | Ron Cey | 2016 | John Smoltz |
1955 | Deacon White | 1976 | Earl Averill | 1996 | Keith Hernandez | 2016 | Frank Thomas |
1956 | Luke Appling | 1976 | Heinie Groh | 1996 | Chet Lemon |
Kevin Appier had a much better career than I realized. Still wouldn’t call him a hall of famer, but he isn’t as underserving as I felt he was when I first saw him on this list
Appier was a real surprise for me as well. From 1990-1997, Appier’s ERA+ was 140. As far as guys who I would argue for the Hall he would not be the first on the list, but like you said he’s got a much better case than most people give him credit for.
The bigger point in my view is that nobody has been more screwed over in recent years by stingy voters than modern day starting pitchers.
I think guys like David Cone and Dave Stieb actually do have pretty strong HOF cases. But when we’re throwing guys like Kevin Brown off the ballot after one vote, and looking at pitchers like Curt Schilling who was top ten in ERA nine times in his career as being borderline, someone like Cone doesn’t even stand a chance.
Voters keep debating and the glut of deserving inductees keeps growing.
Coming in at #100 on the All-Time list: Billy Hamilton*!
*not THAT Billy Hamilton.
Sliding in at #100?
Also the early 70’s would be a banner time for HOF names under this new system: Cupid Childs AND Urban Shocker!
Not many catchers in this hall of fame. Does your system penalize catchers for lack of ABs?
The pitcher ranking column appears to be missing from your top 100 list.
Also, since the hall of fame election is data driven, you should be able to determine the winners of the 2017-2021 elections. Curious who they would include (would Jeter, Piazza and Jim Edmonds make it?).
Your system does find some overlooked players – ie Reggie Smith and his 137 OPS+ and 54.5 bWAR, it does seem to include many similar “very good but not great” players. Cesar Cedeno w a OPS+ of 123 w 52.9 bWAR; Jose Cruz w a OPS+ of 120 and a total of 54.2 bWAR; Ron Cey and his 121 OPS+ and 53.5 bWAR; Chet Lemon w a 121 OPS+ and 55.5 bWAR; Sal Bando w a OPS+ of 119 and 61.4 bWAR; Roy White and his 121 OPS+ and 46.7 bWAR as well as a player line Heinie Groh w a 118 OPS+ and 48.2 bWAR.
Too few All Star games amongst them and too few “great” players.
Interesting. I’ll have to take the time and read through in detail (as opposed to skimming the explanation the first time… ) The name I was most surprised by? Bobo Newsom!
Why No Tom Glavine
Yet me just say that I think most all of these comments are pretty solid.
With regards to the Hall picks I have, I would say don’t necessarily look at it as a validation or a lack of validation of a player’s great. If I was the be all end all voice of the Hall, this is not how I would have it set up. The idea was more to show the type of players that would be elected if the HOF tried to represent each era relatively equally (which I think they should do) rather than who the players would be themselves.
Guys like Ron Cey, Reggie Smith, Jose Cruz and Bobo Newsom are right on the border. All of these guys are in the low-mid 200’s. There’s guys like Dennis Martinez, Willie Randolph, Dave Winfield and Fred McGriff who are right there with them and didn’t get in simply because of modern competition surrounding them. Same issue with Tom Glavine who at 124 is better than some first ballot guys I have listed. If I did the HOF for next year as well, Glavine would be in. Similar issue with guys like Mike Piazza, Jim Edmonds and Manny Ramirez. The modern competition had far more to do with them not getting in than their actual ability.
What this list is really about is identifying the players that can really help you win a World Series. Someone like Bobo Newsom would most likely not be the best player on a World Series winning team. But if he’s your third or fourth best player and the year we’re talking about is in the mid-late 1930’s or 1940 without even knowing who the players are I can you with relative certainty that’s going to be a pretty loaded roster.
If you look at the World Series teams throughout history and match it to my list, you’ll find most every team to win it has at least 2-3 HOFers on them, sometimes 4. Not including any year after 2001, the only teams to win a World Series without the benefit of at least one HOFer listed are the 1907/08 Chicago Cubs, the 1914 Boston Braves, the 1925 Pittsburgh Pirates and the 1988 Los Angeles Dodgers. To be fair it holds true for the real HOF as well, but there’s no year in my system where a team has nine HOFers on the roster. But the 1932 Yankees do. (Combs, Dickey, Gehrig, Gomez, Lazzeri, Pennock, Ruffing, Ruth and Sewell) While the Detroit Tigers a team that won 104 games in the regular season as well as the World Series is still sitting at a goose egg for the number of HOF players in. I don’t even think its possible to win that many games in a season without the benefit of at least two HOFers on your roster and that’s where Chet Lemon, Allan Trammell and Lou Whitaker come in. You could easily swap out Lemon for Darrell Evans on that list, or even include Evans as well. Point is if the HOF keeps going at the rate they are with inductions, you’re going to get more and more of those teams. Even the ’98 with 114 wins still don’t have a single member in the Hall. That will almost certainly change when Jeter and Mariano come up for induction and they would be inducted in my system as well. But Tim Raines and David Cone are already in under my system and I don’t think either one is that controversial of a pick unless your standard relative to who has historically gotten in is insanely high, which I think is exactly what’s happening right now.
One of the toughest things to figure with this is where to draw that line. Mine is probably a lot higher than most, but there’s also fewer guys in my Hall of Fame than there are in the real one, so even as low as it might be in some people’s eyes I still would argue my standards are actually higher than the real one. Where the line should actually be drawn I think depends a lot on how you view the Hall of Fame. I have no problem with someone saying they don’t think Reggie Smith should be, because if I was going to pull people from this list he would be one of my first choices to go to. But regardless of where that line is drawn, the main thing I think is to be consistent and if nothing else the Pyramid Rating does that.
Hi Paul,
Was continuing to think about your article and the rating system you describe. That alone makes one think it was a great and very useful article. I believe that OPS+ has about a 10 point standard deviation in any given year. Given that the top 5% of players that you seek would equate to a 2 standard deviation in value, this would equate (ignoring base running and defense) to an OPS+ of about 20 points. I believe that this is why so many of the batters have an OPS+ of about 120.
Some questions:
Is the basis for your rankings Baseball-Reference WAR?
A number of other versions of WAR exist that offer different and potentially better insights, are these part of your conclusions?
Wilbur Wood and Sal Bando do quite well with B-R War, but are short or well-short of hall standards by others.
Are only 2 catchers part of the 161 best players of all-time?
If you were starting a franchise, would Yogi Berra really be the 287th player you would select?
Deacon White, George Wright, Paul Hines, Fred Clarke, Jim O’Rourke, Buck Ewing, Tim Keefe (419!) were 19th century standout baseball players that are listed as borderline or well short of induction, do you have a timelining adjustment, meaning a pennant is less valuable in that time era than the present, or adjust for length of player seasons?
Do you award players war, major league equivalency, or integration credit? Ted Williams donated almost 5 years of his life to the war effort, does he get a credit at some level of performance for serving the country, and how would you allocate this?
Intriguing ranking system, with massive emphasis on peak over career, it’s shocking to see Clayton Kershaw up at #40 but he has been quite dominant.
Do you have a yearly valuation spreadsheet to share with others?
Thanks for the hardwork, we all learn by new research 🙂
With regards to WAR it is based off baseball-reference. I don’t really have a reason for why I chose that over another system beyond any reason other than it was the most accessible data I could find. Can the system be replicated using another variation of WAR? Absolutely and its one of the reasons I would say these rankings are estimates not absolutes, because this system is only going to be as accurate as that stat is.
With regards to Berra and other catchers I will agree, again I would go back to the concept of value versus talent. Do I think the difference in talent between Berra and Gary Carter was really that great? No. But compare the number of bases being stolen in Berra’s era versus Carter. Gary threw out more than double the runners Berra did and its not because Carter had that much better arm than Berra. Teams were just running more and that gets factored in. Had Berra been born 20 years later and came up in the 70’s, there’s no doubt he would have been much higher, possibly even in the top 100. Era differences can matter that much.
Berra’s ranking is pretty much equal to that of Nellie Fox and given an option between who I would want on my team between the two I would say its pretty much a pick’em. For Berra to get in the top 100 though, he has to be in the same ballpark as someone like Frank Robinson who’s at 82. Berra was top ten in OPS five times in his career, Robinson was 16 times. Defensively Berra was a much better and more valuable player than Robinson in that regard, but it would almost have to be like comparing Ozzie Smith to Adam Dunn for Berra to close that gap. But again put both Berra and Fox in the 1970’s where Fox isn’t getting as many groundballs and Berra is tasked with throwing out a lot more runners and its different story.
With Williams and other WWII players, no they did not get credit for missed seasons, because its a value based system and a player who doesn’t play at all has no value regardless of how good they might be if they got a chance. Same thing with negro league players. My system assumes that someone like Josh Gibson never existed. Does that mean that I don’t view guys like Martin Dihigo and Satchel Paige as deserving HOFers? No.
As far era adjustments go, I would say to read the first article I wrote and you’ll see how its basically built in. As it is with players in the 1800’s, if you go to 1883 there’s four players who were active that year that are in the top 100. There were only 258 players in the league. You might be able to argue there should be another player or two from that year in the top 100, but I don’t think you can justify putting more from that era in without also saying the players who played back then were just inherently better than the players that came after.
As far as season length being an issue, I would just point to Ross Barnes at #39.
I have a spresheet that breaks it down on a yearly basis and the only reason it wasn’t included in the article was because of size issues (59KB) although I’m happy to e-mail it to people individually.
The value of Berra vs Carter is more to do with their contemporaries. From 1948 to 1962 the average catch in baseball hit something like 240 with 8 HRs and 45 RBIs. Berra and his .285 BA w 27 HR and 109 RBIs gave the Yankees a HUGE advantage in the catching position compared to Carter’s contribution over Bench, Fisk, Munson, Simmons, etc.
If you looked at the difference in production between the first and second best player at every position and measured that out, I would say in roughly half the years the position with the greatest difference be between the first and second best player would be catcher. Chief Myers in 1913, Ernie Lombardi in 1942, Johnny Bench in 1969, Joe Mauer in 2009. Even Buster Posey from last year was significantly better than any other catcher in baseball.
But in terms of how catchers compare to other positions, that type of comparison doesn’t tell you anything. I may not be able to counter Yogi Berra with another catcher, but that doesn’t mean I can’t make up that difference another way. How easy or difficult that is to do also depends on how much the position actually matters, which is also not accounted for with these types of position on positions comparisons. If more bases are being stolen in year X than in year Y, there’s going to be a higher correlation between catcher arm strength and wins in year X than in year Y, unless there’s unaccounted factor involved that’s countering it in some way.
If the value placed on catcher arm strength is going up, something else has to be coming down and I’ve found that to be much more difficult to define because its not a one for one trade.
Why was Babe Ruth only elected in 1942, not 1936. I don’t get it.
Five year waiting period.
Funny how the three players of the four players of our era – Bonds, Clemens, and Rodriguez (minus Randy Johnson) – were all steroid users. Love to see charts for those three players compared to other HOFers to see how much of an outlier their stats were from ages 32 and up (or whatever the agreed upon age of is when one’s talent starts to break down and therefore a drop in number should occur).
Great article with solid explanations and details.